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dizzydemon
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| Posted: 05 September 2010 at 3:48pm | IP Logged
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Simple Question: The R/O8 Cessation of Time card states the following:
-When played during an opponent's Draw Cards Phase that phase is ended
-Prevents any and all card draws.
-Placed at the bottom of the discard pile after use.
My question: Can this card ONLY by played during the Draw Cards Phase?
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Lobo
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| Posted: 05 September 2010 at 7:21pm | IP Logged
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-This is another poorly worded card. There are quite a few in the sets. Actually, i take that back. I don't have a problem with the wording so much as the structure of these card rules. When you read the FAQ and the rules, some card rule ordering matters when other times it doesn't. That lack of consistency is troublesome.
There may well be a meaning to making sure you don't draw cards AND you end the draw cards phase. There may be cards that take advantage of said phase, but i'm drunk and can't think of them right now.
Presumably, it was meant to read something that meant prevents all card draws for the entirety of that player turn only, from the point of reaction to the end of that player turn.
If it was meant to *only* be played during the Draw Cards phase, it should say that. Otherwise, unless it would severely disadvantage or ruin the group, i would say it can be played any time a reaction can be played, and the negation of card draws lasts for that player turn only.
As anything, though, feel free to house rule away.
Lobo, going back to cleaning up the kitchen
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 09 September 2010 at 10:06am | IP Logged
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Yeah, I think Lobo's right here. it's not entirely clear from the wording.
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 12 September 2010 at 5:39pm | IP Logged
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It's poorly worded, yes, but still should be fairly obvious. You play it
during your opponent's draw phase and they can't draw cards and
their turn is over.
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Matchbox
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| Posted: 12 September 2010 at 7:07pm | IP Logged
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this card works good, especially when some has a cyber mage and an alliance treaty(?) out there.
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 13 September 2010 at 4:27pm | IP Logged
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MogwaiSC wrote:
| It's poorly worded, yes, but still should be fairly obvious. You play it during your opponent's draw phase and they can't draw cards and their turn is over. |
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turn or draw phase?
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 13 September 2010 at 9:01pm | IP Logged
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Draw phase is the last part of the turn, so both.
If you were to play outside of their draw phase, as it is worded, it
would prevent them from drawing cards, but there really isn't
anything else to do during draw phase, so it's pretty much moot.
However, I suppose (again with the wording as it is) you could play
it during Allocation phase to thwart someone buying cards with a
Research Developer, as it does say "prevents any and all card
draws". Logically, that would mean it would stop their draws
during draw phase as well in that case.
Perhaps more powerful of a card than we had originally thought...
How do I come up with this stuff? :-o
Edited by MogwaiSC on 13 September 2010 at 9:06pm
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 14 September 2010 at 8:01am | IP Logged
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MogwaiSC wrote:
| How do I come up with this stuff? :-o |
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Years of practice?
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 14 September 2010 at 4:47pm | IP Logged
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Maybe just natural deviousness. :D
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 15 September 2010 at 8:51am | IP Logged
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Well it's a good reason to make it a card you can't stock many of. Maybe it should have been an o10 though...
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 17 September 2010 at 3:40am | IP Logged
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It's all so subjective... a lot of it depends on what the game context
is too... my research developer example above is a case in point. In
that situation you have very powerful card, but it does only work
once, though it's like a discard equivalency, it goes to the bottom of
the discard pile, so there are ways to recover it for reuse. :-o In
other situations, it might not be such a powerful card.
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 17 September 2010 at 11:23am | IP Logged
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Even if all you do is prevent your opponent from drawing at end of turn it hurts a lot. At least if they draw the maximum of cards they're allowed.
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 17 September 2010 at 8:29pm | IP Logged
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Upon further reflection, it can be pretty nasty if you were to use
something like a temporal engineer and a cloning device. You could
pull it back from the discard pile and completely shut down an
opponent's draws for as long as you can keep the temporal engineer
alive. That would be pretty devastating, even if you could only pull it
off for a few turns.
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Gekonauak
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| Posted: 21 September 2010 at 11:03am | IP Logged
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no, this poorly worded card is *ONLY* played during an opponent's draw cards phase.
There is probably errata somewhere in the GFs.
Edited by Gekonauak on 21 September 2010 at 11:03am
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 21 September 2010 at 11:37am | IP Logged
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Even then it's nasty.... >_<
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dizzydemon
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| Posted: 21 September 2010 at 5:55pm | IP Logged
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I must admit that I am a bit surprised by the responses. I guess the guys that felt all rules printed on a card (card function as indicated by a hypen- then the rule. For example, a C9 Marauder says that it can do two of the following three functions (all of which show a hyphen and then the possible card function.) If you are saying the card in question (R/O8 Cessation of Time) HAS to use the first card function on its card: "WHEN played in an opponent's Draw Card Phase is ended." - then I agree it is VERY poorly worded and should have read: "MUST be played during the opponent's Draw Card Phase". Instead, it says WHEN and then gives a totally different function, if the card owner chooses, of ending ANY and ALL card draws when played. If this function is used, (it IS a reaction card remember), then any card draws an opponent was about to make come to end.
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Gekonauak
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| Posted: 28 September 2010 at 12:22pm | IP Logged
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Looking through all of the published FAQ (in print), I cannot find anything on this card.
I know how the card was played, and how the card would be ruled if it was questioned during an official tournament.
But, I can see a fair arguement if you are going by the "-" being a rule. Played in reaction the card has to perform a function, and the player should be able to choose the second function.
It just was never played that way.
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 28 September 2010 at 12:34pm | IP Logged
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Ah, definately needs a ruling. ;)
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 29 September 2010 at 1:41am | IP Logged
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dizzydemon wrote:
I must admit that I am a bit surprised by the responses. I guess the guys that
felt all rules printed on a card (card function as indicated by a hypen- then the rule. For example, a
C9 Marauder says that it can do two of the following three functions (all of which show a hyphen and
then the possible card function.) If you are saying the card in question (R/O8 Cessation of Time) HAS
to use the first card function on its card: "WHEN played in an opponent's Draw Card Phase is ended."
- then I agree it is VERY poorly worded and should have read: "MUST be played during the opponent's
Draw Card Phase". Instead, it says WHEN and then gives a totally different function, if the card owner
chooses, of ending ANY and ALL card draws when played. If this function is used, (it IS a reaction
card remember), then any card draws an opponent was about to make come to end. |
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This is how our group has played it, that anything with a hyphen in front of it is considered a card
ability and that anything without is flavor text.
Given the exact wording on the card, I agree it should be interpreted as being playable at any time
during a turn, especially given there is no set convention that the first "ability" given on a card has to
be used first. If it is to be played only during your opponents draw phase, the wording should be
appropriate to that.
I guess this is another one that needs to go under the House Rules category...
Of course, if this comes up the next time Galactus and I play GE, I'll bet a months pay it turns into a
full blown argument! :-o :-D
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 29 September 2010 at 12:30pm | IP Logged
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that sounds entertaining. :)
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 29 September 2010 at 4:40pm | IP Logged
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marhawkman wrote:
| that sounds entertaining. :) |
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In retrospect, it can be... Although when it's actually happening it
seems sometimes like we have to restrain ourselves from looking for
heavy things to throw... :D
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Gekonauak
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| Posted: 04 October 2010 at 10:39am | IP Logged
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Well, feel free to use this post as a reference during the game.
MogwaiSC is always right and Galactus is always wrong.
There that should solve all disputes, right?!? :)
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 04 October 2010 at 1:32pm | IP Logged
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No, I doubt that. :p
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 06 October 2010 at 4:27pm | IP Logged
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Gekonauak wrote:
Well, feel free to use this post as a reference
during the game.
MogwaiSC is always right and Galactus is always wrong.
There that should solve all disputes, right?!? :) |
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Well, I wouldn't say ALWAYS...
Just NEARLY ALWAYS.
:-)
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 12 October 2010 at 12:51pm | IP Logged
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Unless Galactus disagrees. :)
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 12 October 2010 at 2:49pm | IP Logged
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marhawkman wrote:
| Unless Galactus disagrees. :) |
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Never changes the outcome. :D He can dislike it all he wants; I'm
still right most of the time... :-)
Just read through the T/B vs planetary destruction thread, you'll get a
sense for how he reacts to being wrong. LOL.
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marhawkman
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| Posted: 13 October 2010 at 11:03am | IP Logged
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Delete the post to hide the evidence?
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 13 October 2010 at 8:44pm | IP Logged
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marhawkman wrote:
Delete the post to hide the evidence?
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Something like that, yep.
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dizzydemon
Devoted
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| Posted: 01 January 2011 at 2:35am | IP Logged
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Thanks for the input all.
Dizzy Demon
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Tarquon
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| Posted: 27 January 2011 at 10:56am | IP Logged
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Good luck finding something to react to in the draw cards phase.
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Galactic Empires : Rules Base
Topic: R/O8 Cessation of Time"
