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Tarquon
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Joined: 02 January 2007
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| Posted: 05 July 2007 at 9:22am | IP Logged
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Any suggestions for 'fixing' the psi empires?
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Eaglepreacher
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| Posted: 05 July 2007 at 1:15pm | IP Logged
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what exactly do you find broken? that would be the place to start. I've found many opinions on any subject.
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ericbsmith
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| Posted: 05 July 2007 at 2:02pm | IP Logged
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One thing I've always disliked about the Psi's is that they can have their location shot out from under them or they can be targeted with weapons fire, making it easier to pick them off. If the Psi is stronger than the location you target the location, if the location is stronger than the Psi then target the Psi. On top of that you can seriously cripple a Psi deck by blowing away the terrain they're playing Field cards to.
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Eric B. Smith
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Eaglepreacher
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| Posted: 05 July 2007 at 3:24pm | IP Logged
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Perhaps then, psis should act as bases when on terrain, they must be shot first. Possibly fields should act as shields on terrain, an F5 field should be worth 5 shield for weapon fire only. But they do not automatically regain points, but must be repaired. But as for criplling a psi deck by blowing away the terrain with fields, I can cripple your shipd deck by doing the same. Thought the ships still protect the HQ hence giving more time to add more terrain where as the psis are killed witht the terrain.
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 05 July 2007 at 4:11pm | IP Logged
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Psy's have the limitations they do because they're both crew and they
protect the Psy Network. I see nothing wrong with the way Psys are done
in the game.
One of our players has a very good Psy deck; whenever he plays it I reach
for my Vektrean deck which is loaded with Marines, Mercenaries, and
Boarding Parties, transporters, and shuttles.
An S7 Vektrean Dreadnought with an R/E6 Vektrean Fighter and a C6
Mercenary is a wonderful thing... :D
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ericbsmith
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| Posted: 05 July 2007 at 4:36pm | IP Logged
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Eaglepreacher wrote:
| But as for criplling a psi deck by blowing away the terrain with fields, I can cripple your shipd deck by doing the same. |
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It's not that the Terrain attacks aren't crippling to all decks, it's that it's particularly crippling to Psy decks because Psy's are likely to be on the Terrain (or a Base on the Terrain), and the Field cards are there also, so it creates a cluster which gets you 2, 3, or even 4 for one when you attack a Psy decks terrain.
MogwaiSC wrote:
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Psy's have the limitations they do because they're both crew and they protect the Psy Network. |
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It's not a question of whether their limitations are reasonable given the game setup, it's whether those limitations are balanced by the strengths of the Psy deck - whether the Psy's extra functions, damage, engagement costs, and lower command point requirements make up for the double vulnerability.
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Eric B. Smith
GE Card Museum
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Tarquon
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| Posted: 05 July 2007 at 9:14pm | IP Logged
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I think the psi vulnerabilities outweigh their advantages. I have never seen a
psi deck succeed in a multiplayer and rarely in a duel (at the master level).
Would making them immune to weapons fire be too much?
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RobPro
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| Posted: 05 July 2007 at 11:09pm | IP Logged
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The problem with Psi is they inherently do nothing. You have to have a Psi and a field card in play on a terrain to get much use out of them... it's partly why the Krebiz were never good, right? Too many cards involved in their basic setup.
The only way to fix this would be making more T/F cards, where it's a terrain with a built in field.
That was my take, anyways.
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 08 July 2007 at 8:05pm | IP Logged
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I agree with Eric: given what you can do with a Psy and field, you can do
some pretty devastating stuff with them. As such, I think the limitations
they have are warranted.
Our Psy player puts a terrain field and a Muse in the reserve of his Psy
deck; you better have terrain of at least 10 strength on the board, or he
kills one of them in your fleet every turn.
Again, this is why I ALWAYS play crew attacks against them and kill them
as fast as I can.
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RobPro
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| Posted: 09 July 2007 at 8:03pm | IP Logged
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The thing is... you beat a Psi deck with a T8 Aesthetic Marine Depot and a Marine in the reserve fleet. Unless they drop a certain C10 on their third turn, there's no way any of their dudes will stick around overmuch.
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 09 July 2007 at 9:13pm | IP Logged
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The Marine Depot is a broken card in our group; we don't allow it. I've
argued for using it just as terrain, without the transporter and cloning
station, but we have one person in our group who insists on banning it
completely.
Again, I see nothing wrong with the way Psys work in the game, or the
limitations they have. As I mentioned, Psys can do some pretty
devastating stuff if they're played right, so I think it all balances out.
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Tarquon
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| Posted: 10 July 2007 at 9:17pm | IP Logged
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While I agree that they can be powerful, I have never seen a master-level
game in which they became powerful. As soon as empires are declared
everyone runs for more anti-crew cards.
look at this typical turn for a psi-opponent:
CP phase A: crew attacks
weapons fire: shoot psi
weapons fire: shoot terrain
CP phase B: maybe more crew attacks
then, after defending against that perhaps several times in a multiplayer,
the psi player has to play enough P&F cards to mount a threat. Unless
he's drawing many extra cards/turn I don't see it.
Has anyone out there played psi at the master-level? Any suggestions?
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Gekonauak
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| Posted: 11 July 2007 at 6:28am | IP Logged
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It simply cannot be done. The problem with Psy's is that everyone realizes how powerful they can become. A Psy allowed to grow unchecked can take on up to 4 players at once. Knowing this everyone at the table ends up eliminating the Psy first. I wouldn't say people run for more anti-crew cards, just everyone focuses their firepower at the Psy first, and then once that threat is gone, they go back to their petty squables.
The only way a Psy can compete is in a duel format.
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Galactic Empires : Rules Base
Topic: 3.0 rules psi
