| Author |
|
Aramax
Exalted
Joined: 14 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 390
|
| Posted: 12 July 2007 at 10:23am | IP Logged
|
|
|
What does your oppenet pop out and you just slide down in your chair
for me its
L8 Frayed Time Spindal,I just get my day ruined by this one everytime I get a stack going!
How about You?
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MogwaiSC
IRC
Joined: 20 January 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 903
|
| Posted: 12 July 2007 at 3:44pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
One of our players has a bunch of deathworlds, I despise them. A C10
War Prophet with an A6 Promotion is particularly disgusting as well...
Spindles can be stopped... load up with R/M4 Time Keepers, Time Skips,
and Temporal Corrections. Anomaly Portals are also particularly effective
because you can put the Spindle back on the guy who played it on you
with one. Demigod Diversions are also good for stopping Spindles. Just
try not to build stacks that are over 20 strength points.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
RobPro
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 835
|
| Posted: 13 July 2007 at 7:05pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Temporal Conscience
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Tarquon
Exalted
Joined: 02 January 2007
Posts: 197
|
| Posted: 13 July 2007 at 8:11pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
The spy terrain. Hate 'em. Really take the fun out of the game. There are
other un-fun cards that I don't like, but these are the worst. Makes me sad
just thinking about them...
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Matchbox
Adept
Joined: 27 April 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 118
|
| Posted: 13 July 2007 at 9:49pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
oh man theres to many for me to count the people i play with have been playin since the game started and have some better cards than i do for one i cant say theres really one i hate beside firing 20 or so at a big ship and gettin a targeting error thrown at me. research matador kinda sucks, luck demon, sheesh theres to many i hate lol
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
bignea
Exalted
Joined: 17 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 124
|
| Posted: 14 July 2007 at 1:39pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
One card in a one on one would be a C10 timeknight with a promotion.
only can play 1 out 3 cards every turn means death quickly.
Luck demond with a zagoth, no luck cards for a while, add a genetic variant to the luck demond needing research from crew only kind of sucks to.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Gekonauak
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1595
|
| Posted: 16 July 2007 at 6:05am | IP Logged
|
|
|
The spy terrain. Hate 'em. Really take the fun out of the game.
I completely understand this comment. Especially when it is followed by a Cat Rep.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Aramax
Exalted
Joined: 14 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 390
|
| Posted: 17 July 2007 at 10:30am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Gekonauak wrote:
The spy terrain. Hate 'em. Really take the fun out of the game.
I completely understand this comment. Especially when it is followed by a Cat Rep. |
|
|
man I love 8 noble scouts,distress beacons and Hand wreckers and the spy terrain.........
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Aramax
Exalted
Joined: 14 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 390
|
| Posted: 17 July 2007 at 10:36am | IP Logged
|
|
|
MogwaiSC wrote:
One of our players has a bunch of deathworlds, I despise them. A C10
War Prophet with an A6 Promotion is particularly disgusting as well...
Spindles can be stopped... load up with R/M4 Time Keepers, Time Skips,
and Temporal Corrections. Anomaly Portals are also particularly effective
because you can put the Spindle back on the guy who played it on you
with one. Demigod Diversions are also good for stopping Spindles. Just
try not to build stacks that are over 20 strength points. |
|
|
I never ever,EVER have a defence card in my hand when the spindal comes my way.......
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Gekonauak
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1595
|
| Posted: 17 July 2007 at 2:27pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Well, i would have to say the promo terrain that have immunities to two card categories. They should have been limited to one. (my fault)
And the Marine Depot shouldn't have existed.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Tarquon
Exalted
Joined: 02 January 2007
Posts: 197
|
| Posted: 18 July 2007 at 10:39pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
I know I hate a card when I don't even enjoy having it in my deck.
These are usually the ones that unbalance the game in some persistent way (mostly promo terrain as just mentioned). Some of the stronger (fleet) time knights are unbalancing, but crew have more weaknesses.
I don't really hate them, but the later cards with the lower quality art saddened me. (I know art is a sore point in the game history.) I always feel a 'zing' when one of the early strength 8/9 ships such as the ship of ancients is put into play in a heated battle - even if it is in an opponent fleet. I have never felt this for the computer generated or cartoony ships. It's hard to explain.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Lobo
IRC
Joined: 04 July 2007
Location: United States
Posts: 533
|
| Posted: 26 July 2007 at 8:28am | IP Logged
|
|
|
-In my limited exposure to the cards, the one i hate so far is the B3 Leopan base. Reason? I got about 30 of them out of the packs i ripped. Now what the bloody hell am i going to do with them? Origami?
.....Lobo
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MogwaiSC
IRC
Joined: 20 January 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 903
|
| Posted: 26 July 2007 at 6:39pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Aramax wrote:
MogwaiSC wrote:
One of our players has a bunch
of deathworlds, I despise them. A C10 War Prophet with an A6 Promotion
is particularly disgusting as well... Spindles can be stopped... load up with
R/M4 Time Keepers, Time Skips, and Temporal Corrections. Anomaly
Portals are also particularly effective because you can put the Spindle back
on the guy who played it on you with one. Demigod Diversions are also
good for stopping Spindles. Just try not to build stacks that are over 20
strength points. |
|
|
I never ever,EVER have a defence card in my hand when the spindal
comes my way....... |
|
|
I've got sort of a notorious track record with this kind of thing... Galactus
is in the group I play in and I've stopped an O10 Planetary Destruction he's
played on me about 8 out of the last ten times. I even used an Anomaly
Portal on one once and put it back on one of his biggest terrain stacks.
It's just that in the group I play in you've got to be able to defend yourself
from stuff like that, so for us, Anomaly Portals, Temporal Corrections, and
Time Skips are staples.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Gekonauak
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1595
|
| Posted: 27 July 2007 at 6:13am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Um, Time Skips? How exactly are you using that to save you?
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MogwaiSC
IRC
Joined: 20 January 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 903
|
| Posted: 27 July 2007 at 3:22pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Any card that says "discarded after use" as per the rulebook, is put directly
in the discard pile after it's played. If someone plays a Time Spindle on
me, I use a Time Skip on it. It's been played, it must then be discarded.
After the players turn is over, the Time Skip is gone, and the Spindle has
already gone away. Same with a Temporal Correction.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Gekonauak
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1595
|
| Posted: 30 July 2007 at 9:12am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Any card that says "discarded after use" as per the rulebook, is put directly in the discard pile after it's played.
That's not true. It is discarded after it is USED. As the card says. Where in the rulebook does it say put it in the discard pile after you play it?
No, your example doesn't work. You can't stop a Time Spindle with a Time Skip.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MogwaiSC
IRC
Joined: 20 January 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 903
|
| Posted: 01 August 2007 at 10:37pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
After it's used? It's used when it is played... to say that the "use" of the
card is only when it's action takes place, and that that's separate from the
playing of the card is sheer horse-s**t. By that logic, at the beginning of
another player's turn, in reaction to his allocation, because ANYTHING can
be reacted to, I play a time skip. Since use is different from playing, under
your distinction, I can then just let the time skip sit there and use it
whenever I feel like it, on anything he does on his turn. Oh please...
The time skip says the card it's played on is treated as if it's not there for
the current player turn. Once that player's turn is over, the spindle goes
to the discard pile, regardless of whether it's "placed directly" to the
discard pile or not. It still gets discarded before it takes effect, regardless
of when the discard takes place, because under your interpretation, the
Time Skip is subject to the same condition.
The result is the same; both cards are discarded at the end of the player's
turn, and since the spindle is treated as if it was not there, it doesn't have
any effect before it is discarded. Now if the card didn't say "discarded
after use", then the time skip would only work for the current player turn,
and then the card the time skip was played on would then take its effect.
Edited by MogwaiSC on 02 August 2007 at 2:42am
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Tarquon
Exalted
Joined: 02 January 2007
Posts: 197
|
| Posted: 01 August 2007 at 11:51pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
As I have always seen it played:
Once the player turn is over the skip is discarded. When the skip is
discarded the spindle is again in play and continues to resolve. Since a
spindle's ability is not restricted to a phase it can resolve. If the stack is no
longer >20 then you may agree that the spindle has no effect.
Wasn't 'discard after use' discussed in another thread?
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MogwaiSC
IRC
Joined: 20 January 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 903
|
| Posted: 02 August 2007 at 2:39am | IP Logged
|
|
|
But the spindle specifically says "Discard after use". Thus, it is discarded
at the end of the playing player's player turn, along with the time skip.
In the case of something like a planetary destruction, then the time skip
would cease to have an effect at the end of the playing player's turn, and
the O10 would then take effect. In that case, something like a temporal
correction, which specifically says it discards a card played or in play
against your fleet, would be required.
There was a big debate about time skips and how they could be used here
well over a year ago. Lots of different issues about them were hashed out.
The simple fact is that the little O1 is one of the most powerful cards in
the game, and I myself argued they should be more limited. However,
Geko himself argued for the very position that I have assumed that has
lead to the use of the Time Skip to derail much more powerful cards.
If anyone has an issue with it, they should simply ban time skips from
their play. I am going along with what has been ruled previously.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Gekonauak
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1595
|
| Posted: 02 August 2007 at 6:28am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Discarded after use - Cards which are discarded after use are not discarded until they are done performing any functions which they perform.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Gekonauak
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1595
|
| Posted: 02 August 2007 at 6:33am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Tarquon is correct in how the play is resolved.
Please note that once the Spindle comes back into play, regardless of whether the stack is now 20 points or more, the stack is still discarded. The 20 points only matters when the Spindle is played.
For added fun. Try playing cards against your opponents stack to bump it over the 20 mark so you can then Spindle it. It works wonders. :)
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Gekonauak
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1595
|
| Posted: 02 August 2007 at 6:34am | IP Logged
|
|
|
However, Geko himself argued for the very position that I have assumed that has lead to the use of the Time Skip to derail much more powerful cards.
I would love to see the thread. 'Cause I certainly do not remember saying anything contradictory to what I am saying now. We have always played it this way, and always will.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Tarquon
Exalted
Joined: 02 January 2007
Posts: 197
|
| Posted: 02 August 2007 at 10:38pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Please note that once the Spindle comes back into play, regardless of
whether the stack is now 20 points or more, the stack is still discarded. The
20 points only matters when the Spindle is played.
yes, I agree with that ruling, but I have found others do not. It leads to an
unexpected situation where a crinkle (or vacuum effect) played to a card
cannot be voided by making the card a basis of a stack in reaction. Most
people expect a crinkle to be voided that way. And when you point out that
the crinkle itself makes the other card a basis of a stack they get that
annoyed look that precedes the whole table turning against you.
(sometimes I worry that I'm too paranoid)
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Gekonauak
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1595
|
| Posted: 03 August 2007 at 7:21am | IP Logged
|
|
|
the Crinkle and VE are exceptions. They *are* voided if you throw a R/A or some such nonsense.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Tarquon
Exalted
Joined: 02 January 2007
Posts: 197
|
| Posted: 03 August 2007 at 9:35am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Geko,
Can you explain that ruling? Is there errata or was this discussed somewhere?
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
RobPro
IRC
Joined: 10 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 835
|
| Posted: 03 August 2007 at 12:29pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
I believe the '20 strength or more' is just a condition to be met upon playing the Time Spindle. If the stack is still in play, although is strength may be different, upon resolution... then that stack is still discarded.
I don't think you could target another stack upon resolution if the original one was no longer in play, though.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
MogwaiSC
IRC
Joined: 20 January 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 903
|
| Posted: 04 August 2007 at 11:33pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Gekonauak wrote:
However, Geko himself argued for the very
position that I have assumed that has lead to the use of the Time Skip to
derail much more powerful cards.
I would love to see the thread. 'Cause I certainly do not remember saying
anything contradictory to what I am saying now. We have always played it
this way, and always will.
|
|
|
Nothing that has been said here changes the facts. The spindle is treated
as not being there until the end of the player's turn. It is discarded at the
end of the players turn, without having had any effect, because it was
skipped, which also lasts for the entire player's turn.
Also, you still haven't addressed my point about your distinction between
"play" and "use". According to that distinction you make in this thread, I
could play a time skip at any time, and since I haven't "used" it, I could use
it at any time on any card my opponent chooses to play on his turn. To
me, this is completely wrong. "Use" = "Play".
As for the other thread on time skips, I don't have the time to go and
search for it, but you yourself said that time skips can be used on
anything, at any time, from skipping a molting off the back of a dragon, to
skipping the entire stack a dragon is a part of. This in spite of the fact
that dragons are supposed to be immune to occurences played to them. I
argued that time skips shouldn't be able to affect cards played to a
dragon, but you insisted they could and many other people here who
weighed in on the matter agreed with you.
That being said, time skips can be played on any card that is in an
opponent's fleet. If he plays a spindle on me, that card is still part of his
fleet, even though it's not a unit. Hazards work the same way. If someone
plays a time wave on me, I time skip it and it has no effect. Both cards go
to the discard pile. There is nothing on the spindle, or the time wave, etc.
that specifically says they still take effect after they are played. On the
contrary, they say they are discarded after they are used. Once they are
discarded, they can't take any effect. It's simple logic.
Here, I quote directly from the rulebook:
Once played, cards remain in play until the actions of another player cause
them to be removed from play and discarded (firing weapons, effects of
occurrence cards, etc.). Some cards are instant and after applying their
effects are immediately discarded (discarded after use). Some cards last a
specific amount of turns and are discarded after that many turns have
elapsed.
- Any card that reaches a strength of ZERO is discarded.
- When a card is discarded all cards played on or against it are
discarded also (except ships and dragons in play on destroyed terrain
cards and cards played to or against several locations).
- Voided Card Plays: Cards that state they are discarded after use and
which are voided by a reaction card are discarded even though they did
not get used.
- Returned to the Hand: When a stack of cards is returned to the hand,
each card in the stack is returned to its respective owner's hand.
Note the section on "Voided Card Plays"... I play the time skip on the
spindle, the spindle is discarded by the skip even though it "did not get
used".
It's that simple.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Eaglepreacher
IRC
Joined: 21 December 2003
Location: United States
Posts: 573
|
| Posted: 05 August 2007 at 7:53am | IP Logged
|
|
|
Ok the whole argument of the Frayed time spindle is a waste. Playing a Time skip on it is a waste. The time skip has a duration of 1 player turn and is then discarded at the end of the current player's phase. The Frayed time spindle is only skipped, not negated and it has no duration so after the time skip is discarded, then the Frayed spindle does its action and is then discarded.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
bignea
Exalted
Joined: 17 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 124
|
| Posted: 05 August 2007 at 8:14am | IP Logged
|
|
|
the spindle and other various cards stating discard after use. since the spindle was not used because of time skip, after the skip is gone then it can be used. the skip does'nt say discard all cards or card when the skip duration is done. the voided because of reaction is when you play like a vacume affect or temp correction which discards the card right away.
this is my point of view.
Edited by bignea on 05 August 2007 at 8:20am
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Eaglepreacher
IRC
Joined: 21 December 2003
Location: United States
Posts: 573
|
| Posted: 05 August 2007 at 12:05pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Ok here is a new way of thinking. If you play a FTspindle on my 20 point stack is there a difference on where I play the time skip? If played on the FTspindle, then there is no rules which discard the spindle but when the time skip expires, the FTspindle takes effect. But what if I play the time skip on the 20 point stack. Should not the ruling be that the FTspindle is now played to nothing and is therefore discarded since it was illegally played. Kind of like playing a C class to a ship. If you time skip the ship since the rules state C class are played to a location and there is no location it should be treated as a bad play the C class is dead in space. simuliar to a bad transporter beam; once done it's done.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Active Topics 
Memberlist 
Search 
Help
Register 
Login
Galactic Empires : News and Misc.
Topic: Whats your most hated card?
