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Lobo
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| Posted: 09 September 2008 at 7:32pm | IP Logged
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-Howdy all. As i cannot possibly be bothered to look this up, due to rounding issues does it take 2x L2 Warp Engine Breach cards or 3x to destroy any one ship (assuming no counters or reactions preventing the damage)? Just curious, thanks.
Lobo
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RobPro
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| Posted: 09 September 2008 at 8:24pm | IP Logged
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Could you post the text of the card?
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Lobo
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| Posted: 09 September 2008 at 8:39pm | IP Logged
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-Played against a ship, but not against a dragon.
-Ship takes structural damage equal to 1/2 its strength
-Discard after use
The older version actually was what initially drew my curiousity, as it is worded that the ship takes structural damage equal to 1/2 its *maximum* strength. Any guidance appreciated.
Lobo
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RobPro
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| Posted: 09 September 2008 at 9:56pm | IP Logged
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On a strength 8 ship, not counting shields, I'd say it would take two of these. On a strength 9 it would take three, if it counts half of the maximum strength.
If it only counts half of the current strength, it'd be impossible to get a ship below strength 1 because things tend to round down.
Does that sorta help? It's how I'd rule.
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Lobo
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| Posted: 09 September 2008 at 10:14pm | IP Logged
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-I took the time to look it up, Rulebook 2.1 says fractions are dropped. So i guess my next question is, does the 'updated' version of the card still do damage equal to half the max strength (say, 4 on an S8 ship) or damage equal to half the current strength?
I realize there are a few cards that permanently reduce strength so they go against max strength, but specifically i am referring to damage by card or weapon here.
Thanks again, time to go to bed.....Lobo
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 11 September 2008 at 2:05am | IP Logged
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You will never be able to destroy a ship that way. It's what's called
Zeno's paradox.
You do half the structure damage with the first card. But, since the new
version says half it's strength, not maximum strength, with the second
one you only do half of the remaining strength. With the third, again,
you only do half of the remaining strength, etc. eventually you'll get to a
point where you can only do a fraction of a point, which will be dropped.
So, for an S8, you'd do 4 pts. with the first, 2 pts with the second, and
one pt. with the third. If you played a fourth, it would do 1/2 pt. which
is a fraction and would be dropped. So you could never destroy a ship
by playing a bunch of breaches on it. Best you could do is get it down
to 1 point.
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Lobo
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| Posted: 11 September 2008 at 8:00am | IP Logged
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-Thanks Mogwai, and that's why i wanted clarification. I was aware if it was against *current* strength the card was less powerful, but it doesn't have any qualifiers at all. So i was just wanting to know if there was an official ruling on the updated version of the card or at least how others played it to know.....Lobo
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Gekonauak
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| Posted: 12 September 2008 at 9:31am | IP Logged
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No, it applies to the strength of the ship. The one printed on the card, so 2-3 cards.
It would say current ship strength if it applied to the damaged strength of the ship.
We took out "Maximum" strength because it didn't mean anything.
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 13 September 2008 at 10:23pm | IP Logged
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Well, it does change things. If it's "the strength" then I think that means
the printed strength. In that case then, what I said above is true. If it's the
printed strength, then not.
That distinction is something that should be clarified. Perhaps someone
with more time could go through Eric's site and figure out which cards
refer to the strength of the ship (or base, or terrain, etc.) and figure out
which ones are in need of clarification, and then Eric could make the
updates in the 2.1 rules.
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Lobo
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| Posted: 14 September 2008 at 9:09am | IP Logged
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-I don't think further clarification is needed. From reading the rules, the Card Strength is always referred to and denoted as "strength" when it is mentioned. No qualifiers are ever applied from what i could see.
Plain reading of the rules, then, would indicate if the text is simply "strength" that it refers to the Card Strength printed on the card. I would further say that unless the card text in question has qualifiers such as 'current strength' that all mentions of "strength" refer to Card Strength as printed.
At least that's what i'm going with. Have a good sunday all, Go Bears.....Lobo
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ericbsmith
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| Posted: 14 September 2008 at 10:35am | IP Logged
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Lobo wrote:
-I don't think further clarification is needed. From reading the rules, the Card Strength is always referred to and denoted as "strength" when it is mentioned. No qualifiers are ever applied from what i could see.
Plain reading of the rules, then, would indicate if the text is simply "strength" that it refers to the Card Strength printed on the card. I would further say that unless the card text in question has qualifiers such as 'current strength' that all mentions of "strength" refer to Card Strength as printed. |
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I'll agree with that, with one minor caveat - cards which add to a cards strength should also be taken into consideration, such as combined cards, Ship Upgrades, and Krebiz Armor. You would *never* take into consideration damage when considering a cards effective strength.
So if you have a S6 Krebiz Cruiser with an S3 Capsule and an E3 Armor on it, it's effective strength is 12, and a Warp Engine Breach would cause 6 points of damage to it.
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Eric B. Smith
GE Card Museum
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 14 September 2008 at 11:56pm | IP Logged
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No, I don't think it is clear. Simply saying 'strength' is open to
interpretation. It could just as well mean current strength.
I've had to deal with this with a player in our group who regularly argues
that just 'strength' means current and not printed strength.
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ericbsmith
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| Posted: 15 September 2008 at 6:35am | IP Logged
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CARD STRENGTH: The strength of a card is the number in the top left
corner of the card next to its card type.
DEFINITIONS
Strength -
The number in the upper left corner of a card that defines its relative
durability. When strength is referenced it always refers to the strength of the
card (as modified by other cards) but not the current strength (as modified by
damage).
These are from the v2.0 rulebook. Clear enough for you?
Edited by ericbsmith on 15 September 2008 at 6:35am
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Eric B. Smith
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MogwaiSC
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| Posted: 15 September 2008 at 1:47pm | IP Logged
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Thanks Eric. I hope you weren't being sarcastic, because I was being quite
honest. We do have a member in our group that argues that if it says just
'strength' that it means the current, not printed strength. Now I know
where to look to point this out to him.
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Galactic Empires : Rules Base
Topic: L2 Warp Engine Breach
